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Substantial shareholder disclosure
18-01-2020, 06:04 PM.
Post: #11
RE: Substantial shareholder disclosure
(18-01-2020, 03:06 PM)corydorus Wrote: The 5% market and the fluctuation. Don't think is useless. At least we know is fluctuating and they are trading.

.

Sometimes, funds sell not because they are trading. It might be because of a big redemption coming along and they have no choice but to liquidate. After that, there might be some new subscription coming along and they bought back the same counter.

Therefore, by just looking at the small fluctuation from 4.99% to 5% at that point in time might not tell you the whole story.

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19-01-2020, 10:08 AM.
Post: #12
RE: Substantial shareholder disclosure
(18-01-2020, 09:27 AM)opmi Wrote:
(17-01-2020, 06:23 PM)specuvestor Wrote: You have to inform the company secretary. SGX is the checker.

Similarly Top20 shareholders is technically from the Company Secretary but nowadays they get their info mostly from CDP, though there may be some scripts floating around.


The scrips will be under the Registrar, who will register the shares transfers under instruction of the Corp Secretary. So the Corp Sec would know and can get the list from Registrar.

"Floating around" scrips that are transferred but not registered with Corp Sec is Boh Pah Kay one...hahaha

Always a delight to hear about the workings and processes from the industry insiders.  Wink

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19-01-2020, 06:35 PM.
Post: #13
RE: Substantial shareholder disclosure
I would expect the stock broker to report if its client's account is holding more than 5% share in the listed company to the Stock Exchange records department .

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20-01-2020, 11:06 PM. (This post was last modified: 20-01-2020, 11:36 PM by specuvestor.)
Post: #14
RE: Substantial shareholder disclosure
(18-01-2020, 09:27 AM)opmi Wrote:
(17-01-2020, 06:23 PM)specuvestor Wrote: You have to inform the company secretary. SGX is the checker.

Similarly Top20 shareholders is technically from the Company Secretary but nowadays they get their info mostly from CDP, though there may be some scripts floating around.


The scrips will be under the Registrar, who will register the shares transfers under instruction of the Corp Secretary. So the Corp Sec would know and can get the list from Registrar.

"Floating around" scrips that are transferred but not registered with Corp Sec is Boh Pah Kay one...hahaha

Singapore scriptless system is immobilisation method. What it means is that physical shares are not transferred around but mere book entry;but one can literally go to CDP to withdraw out the script (share certificate) in registered non-bearer form. That is why when stock delisted you will get a script.

The secretary is in charge of the members record. In the past for corp action, book closure date is very important to be eligible. Just like AGM members’ list book closure to be eligible to vote, eg proxy etc. For listco the cdp does all these automatically but once scripts are withdrawn, the members record reflects the last member’s name. So say you sold the shares OTC to someone but haven’t change the title with the secretary, the corporate action due on ex date will still be entitled to you. (For example a company can play with the operational lag to delay the registration ahead of an important vote)

Case in point is Khoo Teck Puat’s holding In Goodwood Park Hotel

The secretary usually outsource this book keeping responsibility to a registrar.

NB and frankly if you are financially able to accumulate 5% of a listed company’s shares, you probably ought to know the rules, or have Advisors. I think there was a proposal to raise this to 10% but was struck down
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20-01-2020, 11:23 PM. (This post was last modified: 21-01-2020, 12:42 PM by specuvestor.)
Post: #15
RE: Substantial shareholder disclosure
(19-01-2020, 06:35 PM)soros Wrote: I would expect the stock  broker to report if its client's  account is holding more than 5% share in the listed company to the Stock Exchange records department .

Broker will only know if your shares are margin with them and under their custody / title

If brokers know our positions, that also raises other issues.
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21-01-2020, 03:01 PM.
Post: #16
RE: Substantial shareholder disclosure
In Hong Kong, investors have two ways of holding shares - in paper share certificates or in an electronic form within the CCASS (Central Clearing and Settlement System). Either way has its own features which investors should be aware of.
Paper and electronic form

Shares held in paper form are registered in the company's Register of Members under the investor's own name or in the name of a chosen nominee. The registered owner has the legal right of owning the shares, and all corporate announcements and entitlements are delivered to the owner directly. However, paper securities may cause inconvenience as they require physical safe-keeping which can be lost or stolen, and must be deposited back into the CCASS before the securities can be sold on the Stock Exchange of Hong Kong, which may take up to 10 days.

On the other hand, investors who hold shares in an electronic form under the CCASS enjoy the convenience of trading and safe-keeping, as the shares are deposited either in their Investor Participant Account directly opened with the CCASS, or with their broker and/or bank (where their securities accounts are opened) which is a CCASS Participant. Learn more about how to open a CCASS Investor Participant Account.

As the shares deposited into the CCASS will be registered under the name of CCASS nominee (ie HKSCC Nominees Limited), in other words, the investors don't actually have the legal right of the shares, while they remain to be the beneficial owners. It's worth noting that all corporate communications and entitlements will therefore be delivered to the CCASS nominee which will then pass on to the beneficial owners through the relevant brokers and banks.

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21-01-2020, 06:03 PM.
Post: #17
RE: Substantial shareholder disclosure
Thanks Soros this is interesting. I didn't know that CCASS is a nominee structure. Maybe that's why Northbound structure is not surprising. But nonetheless I doubt the brokers will have access to the investors' share holding through the nominee. Actually to find out you can just ask your brokers if he knows how much you hold in xxx

Used to be that post 1998 HK brokers will always ask you when you are selling if it is a short sale as they have to report to HKEX. They wouldn't need to ask if they had access.

In Singapore CDP is just a custodian and the title goes to the direct beneficiary. SRS or CPF on the other hand uses the nominee structure.
=========== Signature ===========
Before you speak, listen. Before you write, think. Before you spend, earn. Before you invest, investigate. Before you criticize, wait. Before you pray, forgive. Before you quit, try. Before you retire, save. Before you die, give. –William A. Ward

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21-01-2020, 07:34 PM.
Post: #18
RE: Substantial shareholder disclosure
My broker ( HK Bank ) sends me a monthly paper statement showing what stocks are held on last day of month in my securities account plus a summary of all buy/sell transactions during the month.

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22-01-2020, 10:14 AM. (This post was last modified: 22-01-2020, 11:53 AM by specuvestor.)
Post: #19
RE: Substantial shareholder disclosure
Sorry to go off topic just curious are you using a margin or nominee account? For example in POEMS, for direct trades we can't see holdings but margin account yes. Similarly for Nominee structures like SRS we can see "our" holdings becuase the Nominee seperates it out on their books

The corollary is that if under nominee the broker will have to inform the secretary when the total under Nominee is >5%. So hint hint to the big timers here Smile
=========== Signature ===========
Before you speak, listen. Before you write, think. Before you spend, earn. Before you invest, investigate. Before you criticize, wait. Before you pray, forgive. Before you quit, try. Before you retire, save. Before you die, give. –William A. Ward

Think Asset-Business-Structure (ABS)

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22-01-2020, 12:46 PM.
Post: #20
RE: Substantial shareholder disclosure
My shares are purchased through the bank's broking unit and the shares are held in the bank's broking unit "client account" at CCASS.

If the broking unit goes bankrupt, I should be able to claim back my shares from CCASS using the monthly statement to prove ownership.

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