One issue here is that most forumers here are investors, or speculators, or somewhere in between. We know our money, and want to do something about it. But... What percentage of population are we representing? I don't think is more than 20%, or probably even less than 10%.
When the govt issue a policy, there are at least another 80% whom they have to take care of. These people are risk adverse and don't like to see volatility. If the CPF rates is to "float" based on whatever returns the govt can generate, they will be panic!
Of coz, the govt can always "guarantee" a higher interest, but will that lead to higher inflation, or higher tax? I won't know the implication as it is too complex for me.
What I like about the current system is that it provide a stable return. It good for me to do my planning. I know (roughly) how much I will have when I reach 55 or 65. I know my shortfall, and I can do my best to cover the shortfall. If CPF return is to "float", then I will need to give greater margin in my calculation.
I must admit that I am pretty risk adverse, thus I don't invest like many of the forumers here do. I am in for CPF, CPF Life, annuity, whole life plans, endowments, bonds, and even FD to provide for my future.
To specuvestor, I do track the bonus payout for my wholelife, annuity and endowment plans. And I am glad that I bought them from the insurer who has yet to cut their bonus (based on their BI projections). So I still get what I was promised (so far). Cross fingers for the next 15yrs.
(06-02-2015, 09:19 AM)NTL Wrote: [ -> ]To specuvestor, I do track the bonus payout for my wholelife, annuity and endowment plans. And I am glad that I bought them from the insurer who has yet to cut their bonus (based on their BI projections). So I still get what I was promised (so far). Cross fingers for the next 15yrs.
I reckon the wholelife, annuity and endowment plans, were bought after insurers have been faulted on their projections. After the few court cases, insurers, are very realistic on their projection now, instead of 7%-10% previously.
(05-02-2015, 10:59 PM)sg550319 Wrote: [ -> ] (05-02-2015, 09:45 PM)CCUV Wrote: [ -> ] (05-02-2015, 08:45 AM)Jacmar Wrote: [ -> ] (05-02-2015, 07:27 AM)CCUV Wrote: [ -> ]All these talk about not having enough for retirement was down partially not having a good enough return on cpf....all these talk wouldn't even surface if return are reasonable.
I have to disagree with your view on this and the rest of those in the camp that says CPF should give us better returns. Just to be clear I was not in govt before and don't want to launch into a political debate on this.
Sure who don't want to get more for your savings but it comes with a risk. the CPF can give you more but are you prepared that in some yrs there might be zero or negative returns? In this world of near zero interest rates where can you get a risk free returns of >2.5%? In fact I still have my CPF OA $ which I can withdraw(I am pass 55) in there as I cannot find a risk free rate better than 2.5%. do let me know if you do.
The govt by giving >2.5%(some amt as much as 4.5%?) for your cpf money is already indirectly giving money to the pop when they could easily go out and issue bonds with lesser interest. just go look at what govt bonds paying now. as Oliver says we want more!!
The cpf system has failed badly my friend,you might have a different view. A good system wouldn't ask the cpf holder to extend their retirement age and all those boastful media saying about temasek and gic excellent return had not translate into better return without government increasing gst. I rest my case
actually you dun have a case. pl understand the system before throwing rocks. case in point, find out what is the new OZ retirement age.
fyi, i top up everything possible in CPF.
I take it you will sign up for the Enhanced minimum sum scheme?
^^ I would sign up for ERS in lieu of SRS if tax exempt and giving 4%/ SGS 10 year return
(06-02-2015, 09:34 AM)CityFarmer Wrote: [ -> ] (06-02-2015, 09:19 AM)NTL Wrote: [ -> ]To specuvestor, I do track the bonus payout for my wholelife, annuity and endowment plans. And I am glad that I bought them from the insurer who has yet to cut their bonus (based on their BI projections). So I still get what I was promised (so far). Cross fingers for the next 15yrs.
I reckon the wholelife, annuity and endowment plans, were bought after insurers have been faulted on their projections. After the few court cases, insurers, are very realistic on their projection now, instead of 7%-10% previously.
Do make sure it is not reversionary bonus that only pays out on maturity or "event"...
(06-02-2015, 09:19 AM)NTL Wrote: [ -> ]One issue here is that most forumers here are investors, or speculators, or somewhere in between. We know our money, and want to do something about it. But... What percentage of population are we representing? I don't think is more than 20%, or probably even less than 10%.
When the govt issue a policy, there are at least another 80% whom they have to take care of. These people are risk adverse and don't like to see volatility. If the CPF rates is to "float" based on whatever returns the govt can generate, they will be panic!
Of coz, the govt can always "guarantee" a higher interest, but will that lead to higher inflation, or higher tax? I won't know the implication as it is too complex for me.
What I like about the current system is that it provide a stable return. It good for me to do my planning. I know (roughly) how much I will have when I reach 55 or 65. I know my shortfall, and I can do my best to cover the shortfall. If CPF return is to "float", then I will need to give greater margin in my calculation.
I must admit that I am pretty risk adverse, thus I don't invest like many of the forumers here do. I am in for CPF, CPF Life, annuity, whole life plans, endowments, bonds, and even FD to provide for my future.
To specuvestor, I do track the bonus payout for my wholelife, annuity and endowment plans. And I am glad that I bought them from the insurer who has yet to cut their bonus (based on their BI projections). So I still get what I was promised (so far). Cross fingers for the next 15yrs.
i agree with you to a certain extent. i just glance through the new recommendations especially on RA and retirement, and i got a "headache". What so many choices-at least 3 to choose. For most people who are layman the headache will be bigger. i know i have a headache already. Why? The more choices you have the more you have to find out which one is most suitable. That means more work needed to be done, weighing the options. Options is good only for those who knows what is suitable for them. The rest is still more headaches for them to think and think. Human beings is often wishy, washy(贪心). Every option has it's pros and cons.
More headaches?
That's a good demonstration of hard to please electorate.
(06-02-2015, 09:34 AM)CityFarmer Wrote: [ -> ] (06-02-2015, 09:19 AM)NTL Wrote: [ -> ]To specuvestor, I do track the bonus payout for my wholelife, annuity and endowment plans. And I am glad that I bought them from the insurer who has yet to cut their bonus (based on their BI projections). So I still get what I was promised (so far). Cross fingers for the next 15yrs.
I reckon the wholelife, annuity and endowment plans, were bought after insurers have been faulted on their projections. After the few court cases, insurers, are very realistic on their projection now, instead of 7%-10% previously.
I bought those policies in 2004, 2012 and 2008 respectively. The projections in the BIs are based on 3.75%/5.25%. I know that it was higher before, but I don't have the exact. All the policies are bought based on what they guarantee to deliver, not based on their projections. The non-guarantees will be the "extras" that I will be getting.
(06-02-2015, 09:58 AM)specuvestor Wrote: [ -> ]^^ I would sign up for ERS in lieu of SRS if tax exempt and giving 4%/ SGS 10 year return
(06-02-2015, 09:34 AM)CityFarmer Wrote: [ -> ] (06-02-2015, 09:19 AM)NTL Wrote: [ -> ]To specuvestor, I do track the bonus payout for my wholelife, annuity and endowment plans. And I am glad that I bought them from the insurer who has yet to cut their bonus (based on their BI projections). So I still get what I was promised (so far). Cross fingers for the next 15yrs.
I reckon the wholelife, annuity and endowment plans, were bought after insurers have been faulted on their projections. After the few court cases, insurers, are very realistic on their projection now, instead of 7%-10% previously.
Do make sure it is not reversionary bonus that only pays out on maturity or "event"...
About the "reversionary bonus that pays out on maturity or event", you mean I will not get the illustrated value if I surrender the plans? If so, nothing to worry as I intend to hold on to them.
(06-02-2015, 10:59 AM)egghead Wrote: [ -> ]That's a good demonstration of hard to please electorate.
Yes, we are all different ma. But do you know in the past , a certain number of years when banks's FD rate were higher then CPF's O A rate then what did our G did then? You were left on, your own device then. What risk free return from our G at that time? Nothing O. K. You had to take risk then or happy with 2.5 %{IRRC}.
just received a reply from town council today, sccc charges going to increase to $53.25 from april this year up from the current $51..that a hefty 4.4% increase...
did our cpf monies rate of returns from the interest increase so fast in a year if obediently keep in oa/sa?